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PostPosted: Mon Sep 22, 2008 5:40 am 
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I was recently up with a flight instructor getting checked out to rent a plane at new airport. During an approach stall the CFI pulled the mixture. I did not see him do this as I was focusing on keeping the plane coordinated during the maneuver. By the time the nose dropped the propeller has stopped spinning. I recovered from the stall as usual, threw in the throttle and noticed that the mixture was out. I asked the CFI why he would pull out the mixture and he said "to simulate and emergency." We got the prop restarted and finished the simulated emergency. Never in my training had I ever seen a CFI pull the mixture to simulate an emergency. This seems unsafe to me and I was wondering what the general consensus is.


Last edited by adamjs on Mon Sep 22, 2008 7:47 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 22, 2008 7:18 am 
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doesnt really seem like much of a simulation when the engine is actually dead, eh?

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 22, 2008 5:09 pm 
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I'd love to hear what the guys on the CFICast think of this. I bet they'd have some pretty strong opinions..... Actually, I think I may have heard them talk about this, something about how when the prop stops it's no longer a simulated emergency, it's an actual one....


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 23, 2008 2:08 am 
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dcfly wrote:
I'd love to hear what the guys on the CFICast think of this. I bet they'd have some pretty strong opinions.....


Well Tony, whose post is just above you, would be one of the ones commenting on the CFI cast. Reading between the words, I kind of have an idea what he might say.

Normally, it is pretty difficult to get a prop to stop. You have to be going pretty slow. In the original post, the OP said they were doing stalls when the CFI pulled the mixture. In that case I would suspect that the prop WOULD stop unless the nose was lowered and speed built up rather quickly.

I don't think pulling the throttle to idle is a very realistic simulation of an engine failure. Likewise, I think pulling the mixture isn't really a good simulation. I mean really. The student sees the CFI pull the throttle, or mixture, he immediately knows there is an "engine failure". Given THAT choice, I would advocate using the throttle rather than the mixture.

Having said that, how does the brain trust propose a good simulation that introduces the surprise factor of a complete engine failure? How about something less severe, such as a bad mag, or carb ice, or any of many other reasons for power issues?


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 23, 2008 8:55 am 
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greg

true that an instructor pulling the throttle (or mixture) out is not the best simulation of probably the actual sequence of events in a real engine failure, but i really cant think of a way to do much better.

i fly low performance gliders somewhat regularly but i still have absolutely no interest in intentionally shutting down an engine on a single engine airplane. it takes the 'simulated' out of simulated emergency.

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 23, 2008 4:37 pm 
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Different strokes, I guess. But I will be upfront here. If you are going to pull a knob, there is no difference in outcome with either the throttle or the mixture, so why not use the throttle.

At the risk of getting slapped down here, (I am a big boy, I can take it. :lol: ) I don't think the ACT of pulling the mixture is an emergency. The emergency begins when the prop stops. As I said earlier, it takes quite a bit to get the prop to stop unless you are already slow. So as long as the prop hasn't stopped, and the cable on the mixture hasn't broken, no emergency, IMO.

I have been known to shut the fuel valve off on high wing airplanes. ( Yeah, I know, I know) but frankly, I don't have too much of a problem with that because with gravity feed, there is pretty much no chance that the engine WON"T start.

Anyway, as they say, let the flaming begin.

:lol: :lol: :lol:


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 23, 2008 7:36 pm 
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the only difference to me is that when i pull the throttle the engine is still running. and there's no chance that the engine wont start running again because it never died.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 24, 2008 8:58 pm 
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Unless you forget the carb heat and it ices over. :lol: :lol: :mrgreen:


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